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Old mercier
 
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Quote this post and reply to it Post#1 @ 04-06-02 , 05:05 AM


What do you do when someone deliberately sets out to cheat you?

This ex-colleague of mine, an Indian lady, she approached me last year in November, around her "Indian Festival" period and asked me if she could take some jewelry, and give me a deposit first then pay the rest later in December.

Well, come December, she was summoned to court by her bank, for defaulting on too many renovation loan repayments. As she is in the military service, this IS a dischargable offence and she was in danger of losing her job.

Fortunately, I was able to help her and she was offered a renewed repayment scheme by the bank (I even lent her another $400 to help her catch up with the outstanding amount she owed).

So anyway, now she owes me $1500 worth of jewelry, and another $400 in personal loans. She says she'll pay me back in January. January comes and she says she has no money, she'll pay me in February, her uncle is going to lend her the money. Well February comes, and her uncle "who was on his way to transfer the money to her account" changes his mind, so she claims she'll pay me in March, with her year-end bonus.

March comes, and not ONE cent is paid. She claims she used up all her bonus on prayers at her temple. Now it is April, she claims she'll pay me TODAY. She was supposed to give me the money at 2.30. it's now 5 o'clock, and she keeps making excuses about how "her friend who was supposed to pass her the money has not yet reached her house".

I'm so upset. I hate being cheated. When I asked her to RETURN the jewelry in February, she told me "no, I want to pay you bla bla blah.." When I asked again in April she told me her husband had sold it all(pawned it)

I think she deliberately set out to trick me in November, and then pawned the stuff to settle her loan in Decemeber and now is just f**king around!

Part of me wants to say just FORGET the damned loan and never speak to me again, but another part of me is sick and tired of being cheated and I REALLY want to sue her.

What should I do????? *argh*


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Quote this post and reply to it Post#2 @ 04-06-02 , 06:16 AM


What a very cold hearted person. I am sorry that has happend to you. It is unfortunate that this woman/colleague has betrayed you. I would take her to a small claims court. Do you have anything to prove she did this to you??

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#3 @ 04-06-02 , 09:28 AM


Quote:
Originally posted by mercier
I think she deliberately set out to trick me in November, and then pawned the stuff to settle her loan in Decemeber and now is just f**king around!


I know it's not any consolation, but I think that most inconsiderate people are much too wrapped up in themselves to deliberately set out to harm an innocent bystander like yourself. I've known alot of people like this, and they just don't care. I think you should do whatever will help you to forget about this and move on, whether that's taking her to court or ignoring her.

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#4 @ 04-06-02 , 09:45 AM


I think Polyhex has a good point but if you do have proof, anything in writing then maybe bringing her to small claims will force her to pay her debts off. Right is right and she shouldn't have taken from you under the pretense of a loan if she had no intention of defaulting. Some people just have no qualms about taking money from others whether banks or friends while they go on their merry way providing all else selfishly before settling that debt. I guess too you can always file a lien against her home if she was trying to muster up some equity to pay off her other loans.

Obviously you are a very good hearted person who believed the best of this woman who took advantage of that. At least seek comfort in knowing that you may not receive restitution from this incident but your actions will be rewarded in another way when you are least expecting just due to your faith.

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#5 @ 04-06-02 , 09:52 AM


I /really/ dislike people like that. Honestly, it sounds a lot like how my Ex husband use to treat people. Hence, another reason I'm no longer with him. Behind my back, he'd borrow money or "buy" things from our friends on the pretence that he'd pay them back right away. I know for a fact that one loan in particular that was around $900 was borrowed over 7 years ago, and has yet to be returned. And as it stands... I dunno if my parents will ever see the $3,000 for the car (that was suppose to be mine). That's a whooooooole other story.

I think you have every right to sue. And you'd win your case, especially since she keeps promising to pay.


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Quote this post and reply to it Post#6 @ 04-06-02 , 10:33 AM


Unfortunately, we had a "former" friend who was much the same. She would do anything to get what she wanted and was never held accountable b/c someone was always bailing her out of the problem. She stole from our children's PTO fund, over $4000!
My advice is to do what you can live with. If you can go on, do so. If you feel she needs to be accountable, then small claims court. Don't let it eat at you, it will waste too much of your positive energy. By the way, I did go to small claims court over jewelry and a former fiance. I learned that a verbal agreement was as good as a written one in this state and won!! Boy did it feel good!

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well i called her.......
Quote this post and reply to it Post#7 @ 04-06-02 , 12:01 PM


and asked one last time....

the drama of it all...... the excuses, the lies, the "guilt" and "shame"

in the end i decided to just forgeddabout the whole thing.........write it off as an expensive lesson and hope that i don't keep falling for these sob stories next time..................... *sigh*






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"Lord I give you my Heart, I give you my soul, I live for you alone. Every breath that I take, every moment that I'm awake, Lord have your way in me.

This is my desire, to honour you. Lord with all my heart, I worship you. All I have within me, I give you praise. All that I adore, is in you..."
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Quote this post and reply to it Post#8 @ 04-06-02 , 12:04 PM


thank you very much though, everyone................. .

i actually felt much better knowing that i'm not the only victim of "users" such as this..................... ..

i *would* sue.......... except i really think the emotional toil it'll take and all the mud slinging and involvement of former friends and colleagues just isn't worth the $1900...................




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"Lord I give you my Heart, I give you my soul, I live for you alone. Every breath that I take, every moment that I'm awake, Lord have your way in me.

This is my desire, to honour you. Lord with all my heart, I worship you. All I have within me, I give you praise. All that I adore, is in you..."
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Quote this post and reply to it Post#9 @ 04-06-02 , 12:15 PM


Mercier, I'm so sorry. What a horrible person to take avantage of your good nature.

Both my husband and I learned the hard way that money and friendship often do not mix, so there are very few people in our lives we would lend anything over, say, lunch money to. The emotional toll can be too great and hard feelings often result. Luckily, by now, we've weeded most of those people out of our lives, but it's hard turning down new colleagues or acquaintances without just seeming selfish.

Hang in there. This women sounds like she has so many other problems that her karma is bound to catch up with her.



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Quote this post and reply to it Post#10 @ 04-06-02 , 12:22 PM


thanks hest,

that's what i thought you know? about the bad karma....but then i didn't want to be *too* judgemental..

in this last year,

her bank loan was called in by Hitachi bank.

her son fell sick and had to be hospitalized, her daughter fell sick and had to be hospitalized.

her brother fought with her husband and got thrown into jail.

her bank loan was called in by citibank.

her cousin got arrested by our local "FBI" for gangster actitivies

she's suffered at least 5 serious asthma attacks


that's partially why i'm not pushing too hard for the money...... i really don't want to be the one to send her *over* the edge for the sake of two thousand bucks...


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This is my desire, to honour you. Lord with all my heart, I worship you. All I have within me, I give you praise. All that I adore, is in you..."
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Quote this post and reply to it Post#11 @ 04-06-02 , 12:50 PM


Yeah, sometimes it's just not worth it. If you can afford to take a loss, why not be the generous one?

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What a rotten experience!
Quote this post and reply to it Post#12 @ 04-06-02 , 01:06 PM


Sociopaths are sometimes the most charming, and ALWAYS dangerous...I'm sure the other elements of her story are just as bogus as her interaction with you.




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Quote this post and reply to it Post#13 @ 04-06-02 , 01:12 PM


That certainly is a sad story but there are some people who will think nothing of taking advantage of others and who have no conscience. I always tell myself that such people will pay their dues somewhere along the way. Just like I tell my kids when people speed by us on the highway. If they drive like that a lot (and most do) they will get caught sooner or later. Sometimes we see them stopped a few miles down the road!

I actually did something NICE yesterday! My wife found a briefcase in the street about 2 miles from home. It had a diary book, some papers, and old military photos in it. There was a phone # so we called it. The man came over and picked it up. He said he had left it on the hood of his car and drove away. He wanted to give me $5 but I would not take it. He was an older man and I was just glad I could give him his stuff back.

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#14 @ 04-06-02 , 01:27 PM


Mercier,

I am really sorry about your loss, not only of the money, but it sounds like you lost a "friend," and you lost a sense of trust for mankind.

If you really don't want to sue her because you don't have the heart to, all you can do is let it go and learn from this. In the end, you know that YOU were a good person and that you did the best you could. THAT is never anything to be depressed about. THAT is something to be proud of.

What happened to you is the main reason I do not believe in loaning money out to friends. I've seen it happen way too many times to other people. If for some reason my husband and I ever do decide to loan money to a friend, you can bet it will be put in writing and signed by both the lender and the lendee with a specific reimbursement date. I don't believe in borrowing money from friends in general, but if God forbid I ever found that to be the last resort and it meant whether or not my family would eat and borrowing was my only and last recourse, I too would insist a contract so that my friend felt more secure about the situation. I think it is what any decent friend would do. Money changes people. Even the best of friendships can be torn apart over money.

What goes around comes around. It sounds like she's had her due of bad luck, now I'm sure it's your turn to have some good! Please try to stay positive, it could have been worse.


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Quote this post and reply to it Post#15 @ 04-06-02 , 01:51 PM


Awww, that's sweet RM. I knew that under that fuzzy exterior there was a fuzzy heart, too!

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#16 @ 04-06-02 , 03:32 PM


Mercier, I applaud your generosity and am sorry you were hurt. I might encourage you to write the whole thing off as a business lesson. Within the context of a business lesson in general, and a "bad seed" in particular. Don't let this bleed into a greater portrait of humanity. Your generosity speaks much to your character. Be steadfast in that conviction. And proud.

Others -->

I believe lending out money is quintessentially a guy thing. This is not to say women never lend out money, but the perspective of the ladies on this thread reflects the opinion of my girl friends (and my GF, for that matter) in real life.

I'm owed THOUSANDS of dollars from multiple sources. On the order of $7,000 or so. Which I never expect to see again. As such, and as a general rule, I no longer lend out money.

On the rare occasion that I do, I only do so if I can part with the money forever. I "lend" it out with the attitude that I never expect to see it again. It's a "gift" (though I never explicitly characterize it as such to the lendee). If the funds do come full circle, I am pleasantly surprised.

Money is a tricky thing, and, at best, well divorced from friendship.

.Px.

[Edited by Px on 04-06-02 at 02:55 PM]

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#17 @ 04-06-02 , 03:43 PM


That's funny you say that Andrew. After reading this thread I had a talk with my husband because I have known him in the past to lend money to his friends that it took him forever to get back! He is a very generous man Anyway, I told him that if anyone were to ask to borrow a lot of money from us, for him to just say "Let me discuss it with my wife first" and then he can make me look like the bad guy and say to that person "OK, but she wants it in writing." I don't mind looking like the bad guy in this situation, now that we are married if someone screws him out of money, I am fully aware that I will be getting screwed too!


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Quote this post and reply to it Post#18 @ 04-06-02 , 04:03 PM


Hi GIA.

A good indicator of insanity is to do the same thing over, and over, expecting a different outcome. You think I'd learn by now.

I have an awful time not helping somebody if I am able. In any capacity. I've come to learn that money is a different matter entirely, but I still continue to struggle. Generally when friends have asked for financial assistance, it wasn't for tips at a topless bar. There's the rub.

What you suggest is prudent. The analytical half of me agrees wholeheartedly. I guess one way of explaining it is guys would see a contract as compromising their friendship (while freely deceiving themselves that the transaction won't). Kinda like a "pre-nup."

As my GF often points out, guys are dumb. And messy.

.Px.

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#19 @ 04-06-02 , 04:16 PM


Quote:
Originally posted by PX
Hi GIA.

I guess one way of explaining it is guys would see a contract as compromising their friendship (while freely deceiving themselves that the transaction won't). Kinda like a "pre-nup."


.Px.


I know it's hard to say no to friends, and equally as hard to say that you want it in writing (you don't want them to think you don't trust them), which is why I told my husband he has my permission to blame it all on me. I don't mind looking like the B**** to his friends in a situation like this. I'm very nice to his friends, often being the shoulder they cry on when it comes to their female troubles, I don't think they would be offended if I asked for it to be in writing (as opposed to if my husband were to be the one who asked them) since they know that I have a kind and generous heart, but a practical mind. Of course I'm talking money of a substantial amount here, not just a couple of hundred dollars.

I don't think you are insane or dumb by the way You are just a truly generous guy who wants to help out his friends!

So how about handing over that gorgeous Royal Asscher this way my friend, my buddy old pal?!


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Quote this post and reply to it Post#20 @ 04-06-02 , 04:19 PM


I'm sorry this has happened to you!
You have a good heart, and that is evidence of some good in humanity.
We've loaned money to friends also, and it made me feel uncomfortable. Money should never be loaned unless one is able to accept and absorb the risk of never seeing it again. Our two loan experiences:
Our friends wanted to buy their first home. The bank and their family were able to loan them all but $2000. Without the $2000, they couldn't buy the house.
We loaned it with no interest. We signed a contract and they paid it back early. It surprised me because they are not all that responsible.
My husband has a co-worker who was deep in debt, so badly, that his bank charged him $35 every time he wrote a check, because his checks always bounced! He asked my husband to borrow $1200 so he could "get out of the hole." I was against it, as I felt this man was irresponsible. But my husband really wanted to help. So, we loaned him the money at the going interest rate (the friend insisted that he pay interest). Although he was a bit late, he paid it all back. But the clincher is: our money never helped him. He is back where he started, and recently asked to borrow more money. We said no (he's still our friend, though...) As soon as he got squared away, he bought a $1000 guitar. I don't think this 50-year-old man will ever get it right. He makes more money than my husband does, but is unable to stay out of debt.

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#21 @ 04-06-02 , 04:23 PM


Rodent Man & GIA
You are so right in your thread about what goes around comes around for predators like these. These people don't always get paid back in legal way, but emotionally b/c they use up all of their energy destoying themselves by taking advantage of other people.
Mercier,
You 're gonna be fine, keep your chin up! You have a great heart to be proud of....

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Check your e-mail in a sec!

Quote:
Originally posted by GIA
So how about handing over that gorgeous Royal Asscher this way my friend, my buddy old pal?!


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Quote this post and reply to it Post#23 @ 04-06-02 , 08:49 PM


Mercier -

Even if you decide not to pursue matters (as you have suggested) RocDoc makes a good point in filing a police report. Even if they are unable to recover your goods, you'll have a written record you can use next year 'round this time to take a tax loss...

.Px.

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Quote this post and reply to it Post#24 @ 04-06-02 , 09:11 PM


Hi Mercier,

Considering it's tax season, I believe you can deduct that 2000 as a business loss or possibly even as a gift ($10,000 limit). I have a feeling she's going to give you bits and pieces back once she sorts out her life and get things under control again.

Another way to look at it: Seems like she's in desparate need of financial support. Although you lost some money, it should make you feel better that you're in a position to help her out. So in the end..How much are you willing to spend to help a friend in need? ( I know she did lie to you, but it might be because she was trying to save face - it happens a lot with asian cultures)

Give people a chance and they usually do good.

Take care and good luck.

**disclaimer: I'm not an expert in taxes, psychology, sociology, or anything else I happen to mention in my post so please no flames!

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Tax must be an international pain!
Quote this post and reply to it Post#25 @ 04-06-02 , 09:32 PM


It's tax time here also.......

Actually I'm trying to figure out *how* to convert this into a tax loss because I paid off the bill to my store with my own money....... since it's not mine exclusively I didn't think it would be the right thing to do to make everyone share in this loss.

I thank all of you who have offered such encouragement and kind words....

I really don't know if I have a kind heart, or I am just stupid, because the thing is I keep falling for people who approach me with this sob story or that sob story...... end up going all out to help them and then get severely disappointed at the end....... *shrugs*

I guess maybe i'm just young (21)
so given a couple more years i'll be a nice, cynical and worldly wise person


thank you very much, one and all!

you've made me feel *so* much better


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"Lord I give you my Heart, I give you my soul, I live for you alone. Every breath that I take, every moment that I'm awake, Lord have your way in me.

This is my desire, to honour you. Lord with all my heart, I worship you. All I have within me, I give you praise. All that I adore, is in you..."
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